This transcript has been edited for clarity.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 00:00
Heidi, we had a listener question from Jessica. First of all, she asked if we took requests and yes, yes, we do. Makes me feel like a DJ from the early days in radio.
It was such a good question because she was asking about this idea of respect and, specifically, that her kids demonstrate respect towards her husband, but she feels like there’s a different relationship that she has and maybe there’s a lack of respect from her kids towards her, specifically thinking about what kind of parent she is. So I thought this would be a great topic other parents might want to hear about as well.
Heidi Franz, Host 00:36
Welcome back to Parenting to Impress, your go-to podcast, to learn practical ways to love God and love others and impress this on the hearts of your children. I am your host, Heidi Franz, and I am joined by my dear friend, Melanie Simpson. Two moms who have made a lot of mistakes but have found grace and truth along the way.
I love this question about respect. You know, I cannot think about the word respect, without thinking of the song…
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 01:03
R-E-S-P-E-C-T. Yes, ma’am.
Heidi Franz, Host 01:05
It’s a fantastic question because we talk so much about obedience. Think about the Bible verses from the Ten Commandments on your father and mother, and then from Ephesians, “Children obey your parents.” We don’t typically use that word “respect” a lot. I think for a lot of folks it has this connotation that takes us outside the home.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 01:39
We respect police officers, we respect judges, positions of authority. Then when we talk about it inside the house, a lot of times it has a negative connotation.
Heidi Franz, Host 01:43
And that’s a really good point. I talk about disrespect in my home a lot. I don’t talk about respect a lot.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host
What’s that about?
Heidi Franz, Host
I don’t know. You just brought up something that I hadn’t thought about. I will say, “Don’t be disrespectful.” Right, but yet I go back to that idea that I always say in conferences for every negative you have to give a positive. So if I’m just telling my children don’t be disrespectful, but I never talk to them about what disrespect is.
Okay, so let’s kind of springboard off that.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 02:16
What would be an example of a child in your home being disrespectful?
Heidi Franz, Host 02:21
Typically, when we’re talking about disrespect, we are talking about tone and body language in our home. How about you?
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 02:28
Yes, I would say the same thing. It’s the raised tone, or just a rude, rash tone, eye rolling, the sighing, the smirking, or just the outright turn your back on and walk away. Okay, working backwards, then how would we help that child understand what would be respectful?
Heidi Franz, Host 02:46
That’s a really good question. I think respect comes in having a teachable spirit and that can be seen in eye contact, your posture. Are you actively listening, or are you listening because you have to with your arms crossed? Respect is saying I want to listen to you because I feel it has value.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 03:10
And I love this because this draws us right back to the biblical understanding of why we respect in the first place. My mind immediately goes to Genesis, where we are told we are all image bearers. We were created in the image of the triune God.
Heidi Franz, Host 03:27
I love that. The Greek meaning of respect is honor or value. Based upon what you were saying from Genesis 1, I am saying God created you in a beautiful, amazing way and you are worthy of respect. You are worthy of honor, your life has value.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 03:52
Right, that goes across the board, not just for in the home. But what’s fascinating is when we talk about the Ten Commandments. There is another layer there of honoring your father and mother.
I think what Jessica’s question brings out is how she points to her husband. The children seem to innately respect him and then she talks about how she sees herself as more of her children’s friend, and she used the word permissive. I think what the heart of this question is getting at is does how we interact with our kids change how they see us, which then leads to how they honor to use that phrase or respect us as a position of authority, as their mother or father?
Heidi Franz, Host 04:34
Let’s take a little bit of a dive into the idea of different parenting styles. Jessica has said she is a permissive parent. There are also uninvolved, authoritative and authoritarian. First of all, let’s go with the uninvolved parent. Uninvolved parents, they’re just like do what you want, just don’t bother me. If you’re listening, I’m going to say you’re probably not an uninvolved parent, because typically that also involves neglect.
The next one, as Jessica used in her description, is the permissive parent, and that is the parent that is working towards a friendship with their child. The quote that I would use is “Yes is best.” Whenever possible, you are going to say yes to that child and if you can’t say yes, you’re going to work that situation however you can to get it as close as you can to yes.
The next one is authoritarian. When I think of authoritarian, I think of Captain Von Trapp from Sound of Music. That drill sergeant, “Do what I said because I said so. I’m not telling you why.” As a child, you can’t think for yourself. You’re not old enough, you’re not wise enough. I’m bigger, stronger.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 05:59
Or if you do think for yourself, keep it to yourself.
Heidi Franz, Host 06:02
Very good. Because of that, I’m going to think for you. I’m going to tell you what to do, when to do it and how to do it.
The permissive and authoritarian parent styles are extreme opposites. The authoritarian has very high expectations, but I’m not going to help you be successful. Where the permissive says, “I’m going to be there for you all along the way and I’m going to move things out of your path to help you be successful, but I don’t expect you to do much.” So those are the three. Now let’s add the fourth.
The fourth is authoritative. Authoritative is a consultant parent. I think of the idea of a coach where the child is still doing the work as much as they can, depending upon their age, but I am there to coach them, to lead them. I am saying to that child, “You are capable and let’s talk through what you’re thinking. Why do you feel that way?” And then authoritative, biblical parent is going back to the scriptures to say, “What does the Bible say” Not, “What do I say?”
Where do you think you fall, and where do you think you fall from the beginning of parenting to where you are now?
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 07:23
So I would say as a parent of young children, like the pre-K and younger, definitely more authoritarian. That’s mainly because they are learning. I have to teach them all the things.
I would be hopeful, and I like to think that I then became more authoritative. Training my kids and working myself out of a job. Doesn’t mean I don’t love them; doesn’t mean I’m not always going to be there to help them and guide them if they ask for it.
Heidi Franz, Host 07:54
You’re slowly passing the baton until the child is doing more and more for themselves.
Funny story my second son has a job this summer. One of the adults was giving him a hard time that he has to make his own lunch. He’s like, “Why doesn’t your mom make your own lunch?” He was just giving little man a hard time. But Little Man, of course, came back to me and was like, “Hey mom, why aren’t you making my lunch?” And I said, “Bud, because I’m not going to do anything for you that you can do for yourself. That’s called enabling.” I think that’s the difference between the parenting style.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 08:30
I know, my sweet friend Heidi, that if this child needed some assistance in any way, shape or form getting his lunch, she would help him.
Heidi Franz, Host 08:36
When my son comes home from college and he is exhausted, brings his dirty laundry, you know I can do that laundry for him sometimes. Why? Because he’s very capable of doing it and this is a way I can love on him.
Going back to Jessica’s question thinking about permissive, thinking about authoritarian and authoritative where does respect fall into all of this?
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 09:00
It’s really interesting because she even talks about how, if they are obeying, does it matter? If they respect me, I would say, “Yes.” Sometimes we train our children to be obedient and respect is built into that when it’s a healthy relationship.
Heidi Franz, Host 09:18
We respect those people who are willing to say no to us.
Mel, we’ve talked about this many times. Honesty is my love language. For you to come to me and say, “Hey, Heidi, I see this in your life, and this is not what I think you want it to be.” I respect you greatly because you are willing to be honest with me and I think the same thing with kids.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 09:46
Think about the people in your life whom you desire to learn from, who you desire to follow. To learn from who you desire to follow. As a parent, it’s not to be a friend to my child. I mean. I’m guilty of falling into the permissive pit several times, in particular when I see my children in specific struggles, sin, I just want to rescue them, I want to save them. At that point, they don’t want me to be their friend, they need me to be their parent.
Heidi Franz, Host 10:18
Well, and you think back to your favorite teachers, your favorite youth group leaders. Who do you look up to? They don’t make movies about permissive coaches. You know what I’m saying? Because we respect that.
Let’s go back to who is God, as a parent to us? In preschool, we’re always teaching God is our friend and that is 100% true. But God is also judge.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 10:45
We forget God is not God without all of the characteristics.
Part of her question about earning or demanding respect. What a gift it is to teach our children to respect all people. But then this next level, living in such a way that our children know they are safe with us, they are secure with us, and that includes, as you said, Heidi, saying no and not being a friend but being a parent.
The other part of this question is how do you get to the heart of this issue? She has seen the difference between her husband and herself and how her children interact with them and her willingness to acknowledge that she is being more permissive. I think she knows the answer to this question. I would just encourage her to first spend time with the Lord and asking the Holy Spirit for very specific ways that she needs to correct her own behavior so that her children can get realigned with who they are in the home.
Heidi Franz, Host 11:45
How do we teach respect in our home? I think we, as parents, forget that everything starts with modeling. I cannot teach respect if I do not model. Am I respecting my spouse? Am I respecting my parents? Am I respecting the government? That’s really a hot topic right now, especially with the coming election. How do I talk about the government? You know, God has some ways that we are to respect the government. We see it in the gospels. We also see it in what Paul wrote. It does not mean we have to agree with them. We are to respect them, and our children are watching. And it’s a lot of times, those side comments that I catch myself and I think, “What did I just portray to my children in a comment that was meant for my husband, but they heard it?”
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 12:45
This has been so convicting for me how I talk about other people. They’re driving. Lord, help me. My kids would say, “Mom, you’re the most godly woman we know, except when you’re in the car.” And they’re not wrong, and it’s something that I confess all the time. And so how do we talk about our friends and our peers? How do we talk about our pastor and our church? And then even, how do we talk to our children? Are we belittling them or are we building them up?
Heidi Franz, Host 13:16
How do you talk about being a mom, is it draining. Is it exhausting?
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 13:19
So impactful in our little kids’ brains. I mean, they just they hear it all.
Heidi Franz, Host 13:23
If I could go back and my kids were little again, I would have asked their opinion more. Doesn’t mean I have to do exactly what they say, but giving them a say on things that didn’t really matter. With four young children, I thought everything mattered and a lot of things really didn’t. I think that would have shown them more respect had I just slowed down and said, “Hey guys, what do you think?”
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 13:50
This Society has given us an idea of earning respect. It’s a really beautiful conversation when we explain to our kids what would it look like if you had to earn my respect? Now we start getting this whole works-based faith, and that’s not what Christ is about.
So aren’t we glad that, because of His sacrifice, I don’t have to do anything to be respected as an image bearer?
Saying to our children, “Now aren’t you glad that God gave me the role as your mom? And because I’m your mom, I have the privilege of discipling you, and that means I get to teach you about cooking dinner, about reading scripture, about having conversations with people, and I’m so glad that I got to be that in your life and I’m so glad that I got to be that in your life.”
This begins to lay that foundation for them being amazing Christians out in the world, because they have a foundation of mutual respect. That is having a conversation, asking opinions, being good listeners, not being convinced of everything that comes down the road, but discerning and you can only discern after you’ve listened and really molded over. But knowing truth, that is your foundation, be able to compare it to.
Heidi Franz, Host 15:05
So, so true. I think another way that you teach respect is by helping children understand that they are not the center of the universe.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host
Oh yes, preach!
Heidi Franz, Host
We did a podcast about, “How Do you Know If You’re Raising a Brat?” I think a lot of the issues with respect come into play because a child feels that they’re a little bit better than everyone else. Also, helping kids understand that the outside image isn’t truly what’s happening in people’s lives. We’ve got to train children, teach children, model to children what it looks like to give people the benefit of the doubt.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 15:49
Oh, my goodness, that’s really a piece of respect as well. I acknowledge I am a sinner as much as the next person, so I’m going to choose to believe the best of you when you’ve messed up. I’m going to choose to believe that if you could do it over again, you wouldn’t do that. But you’re learning, and so let’s talk about how do we move on from that mistake, from that sin, with God’s forgiveness.
Heidi Franz, Host 16:13
The last point that I would make about teaching respect is serving other people.
Melanie Simpson, Co-Host 16:19
As believers, respect for others means showing up and putting flesh on what it is that we say we believe. Jesus speaks of this in Matthew 7, about doing unto others as you would want done to you. This goes hand in hand with what you were saying earlier about just being compassionate and having empathy and giving the benefit of the doubt, choosing to believe the best of others. In prayer we can demonstrate respect for others by interceding on their behalf and speaking to the Lord kindly of others in our prayers.
Heidi Franz, Host 16:54
After one of my kids was born, Tina, a woman in our women’s ministry, showed up at my doorstep. She had young kids at that time. Her oldest was carrying in bread or cookies. She involved them in that process of loving on our family, just in the fact that they were carrying it in. Now I bet, knowing Tina, she also had them helping her making the food. And I remember when she walked in she said, “We are here to be the hands and feet of Jesus.” And that, right there, my friend, is how we teach respect.
Announcer, 17:35
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Read the corresponding Teaching Respect at Home blog post.